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Posted by Patti on September 22, 2009, 3:09 am
snipped, as this is the bit I can respond to most easily:
show/hide quoted text
>My parents continue to ignore that anything is happening, and
>unfortunately I discovered last week that some of their treatment of me
>whilst growing up can't just be dismissed as a style of parenting, but
>a type of neglect verging on abuse, now I realise that, I can see how
>it has effected my sister too and I have to figure out how to forgive
>them and to continue forgiving them.
>Cheers
>Anne
You have reached the first realisation, and that is good. The next
*most important step is to try to understand why. Once you can see
that, you will be able to come to some form of forgiveness at least. I
don't think you should expect that, if you work really hard on this, you
will get to a stage when all is forgotten and all is well between you.
You may well find that even thinking of their actions still hurts -
every time. However, if you can honestly say that you understand, *you*
will feel better. As others have said, harbouring hurt only eats away
at you.
Continue working with the professionals - and it is *work: hard and
exhausting work. Has anyone suggested Cognitive Behaviour Therapy? It
*might* help, if it is a good fit with what you are going through, and
your own way of thinking. If it doesn't help; if anything doesn't help,
it is just not the right direction for *you*: nothing wrong with the
therapy, not your fault; just the wrong 'fit'.
--
Best Regards
pat on the hill
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Posted by Gen on September 22, 2009, 3:50 pm
What a sad statement, and one that certainly doesn't cover a great many
people. My parents may not have been the greatest , but they certainly did
their best, and I have no complaints. My MIL was wonderful, as was my
FIL-who I unfortunately only knew for 8 years before he died of cancer.
There will never be any MIL jokes or complaints from here-I loved her! My
son has written us on occasion to tell us how happy he is that we're his
parents and how much he loves us. It seems to me, some use their parents as
an excuse for their unhappiness, when they would do well to look into
themselves.
Gen
show/hide quoted text
> Anne, It sounds like you are at the beginning of a long road, one that
> many of us have to travel in our adult lives. I pretty much believe
> that the first and most important job for all adults is to overcome
> the mess made by their parents. Nobody can raise a kid for all the
> years it entails without screwing up royally. But most didn't intend
> to be cruel or indifferent, or .... whatever.
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Posted by Anne Rogers on September 22, 2009, 6:24 pm
Gen wrote:
show/hide quoted text
> What a sad statement, and one that certainly doesn't cover a great many
> people. My parents may not have been the greatest , but they certainly did
> their best, and I have no complaints. My MIL was wonderful, as was my
> FIL-who I unfortunately only knew for 8 years before he died of cancer.
> There will never be any MIL jokes or complaints from here-I loved her! My
> son has written us on occasion to tell us how happy he is that we're his
> parents and how much he loves us. It seems to me, some use their parents as
> an excuse for their unhappiness, when they would do well to look into
> themselves.
> Gen
Gen, until last week I did just look into myself, which is what is
making this realisation so hard and as people probed into it, I was
defending my parents all the way. I KNOW my parents love me, but they
never said it and at times in my life I didn't know they loved me. In
fear of giving me an inflated sense of self worth, they never praised me
or said I was beautiful, which has the exact opposite effect and I have
struggled with low self esteem ever since. All this has conditioned me
into not hearing it when other people say they love me, or that I look
great. They also completely avoid the subject of my depression, when I
spoke to my mum yesterday, we just chatted about random stuff, when I
emailed to say things were hard, they just focused on the practical and
told me to stop breastfeeding, which as far as I'm concerned is not a
topic up for discussion, when I told them that, they didn't reply to my
email. Without admitting all this, I'd likely have done the same thing
to my children.
Cheers
Anne
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Posted by Kate XXXXXX on September 23, 2009, 10:07 am
Gen wrote:
show/hide quoted text
> What a sad statement, and one that certainly doesn't cover a great many
> people. My parents may not have been the greatest , but they certainly did
> their best, and I have no complaints. My MIL was wonderful, as was my
> FIL-who I unfortunately only knew for 8 years before he died of cancer.
> There will never be any MIL jokes or complaints from here-I loved her! My
> son has written us on occasion to tell us how happy he is that we're his
> parents and how much he loves us. It seems to me, some use their parents as
> an excuse for their unhappiness, when they would do well to look into
> themselves.
I was and am singularly lucky in my choice of both parents and in-laws.
My parents were disciplined without being cruel, scupulously fair to all
fours of us, and kindness and generosity personified when that was
needed. They gave me the ability to reason, to question, to argue my
case, and to give in gracefully whan that was what was needed. They
gave me worth in my own eyes as well as theirs, and an independant
spirit. The gave me the ability to to make my own choices and form my
own opinions. And all this before I was legally an adult, at 18.
They taught me that things of value, money, and love, need to be earned
but are given freely and without condition.
I did not always heed their lessons at the time. Which of us do? But I
try to follow their example with my son. So far he had had no
complaints, and at almost 15, under the typical adolecent moodiness and
general feeling of being put upon by the exam system, is a delight to us.
My in-laws were and are the sweetest and most generous of people, loving
spirits and an example of how to be supportive without interfearing or
treading on toes.
I had a wonderful, busy, productive, imaginative childhood (think
Swallows and Amazons with added aircraft!), surrounded by a loving
family who were not afraid to show their love. I had a father who,
despite frequent abscences for work, was very much more 'hands on' than
many of his generation (I was a 50's and 60's child, a 70's teenager and
student).
This did not prevent several prolonged bouts of clinical depression as
an adult. I cannot and will not blame anyone for those. They were
partly a personal characteristic, partly work induced when I was
teaching, and partly hormone induced, and, in later years, have been
added to by the fibromyalgia.
Not all of us posessed by deamons have had them thrust upon us by
others, family or not. And with us all there has to come a time to take
responsibility for our own choices and actions. One of those choices
may well be to cease to be the victim of our parents errors. It is a
very hard choice to make because it goes against all our conditioning
and experience.
The only real error I can lay at my parents' feet is that they loved us
too much: my father, in particular, was torn between his duty to his
queen and country and his duty to his family, and as kids, our education
was fragmented and somewhat less stable than it should have been. he
faught a long battle against sending us to bording school, but I did
enjoy both the experience and the stability once he gave in. However,
we all took it into our own hands, at various stages, to overcome the
handicap, to make the best of what we had, and do what we wanted to do.
Big Sis gained her degree before her 21st birthday, Bro gained an HND
in electrical engineering, and later went on to get a BSc in maths
(mostly atronomy!), and after gaining my teaching certificate, I later
did an MA in modern lit, despite dyslexia. It took longer, I had to
work a bit harder, but I got what I desired. Little Sis opted out of
Higher Education and is an Inspector with the Metropolitan Police,
working with the CID. She's good at it, I hear. I'm very proud of her.
Looking at my life, past and present, I HAVE VERY LITTLE TO BE DEPRESSED
ABOUT! I am extraordinarily fortunate in many ways. I no longer have
to work in the ways and places that produced two of my worst episodes of
depression. It doesn't stop the deamons haunting me. I find it
extremely hard to throw them off because they have no underlying cause,
other than the physical.
Sometimes I think it must be less dificult to work through depression if
you know the causes or have something to 'blame' (for want of a better
term - blame isn't exactly what I mean). You can learn to look the
cause in the face and make a decision about it. When I know it's the
hormones or the fibro, I can grit my teeth and work through it. When
the formless deamons gather, and there is no rhyme or reason to it, and
I am NOT under work stress, I find it much harder to fight off the black
dog and climb out of the pit.
I may be inept, tactless, clumsy, but whatever the cause, I will always
try to hold out my hand to those in the pit, and if I can't pull them
out (I wouldn't presume that was possible), I will at least offer a hand
to hold in the darkness.
--
Kate XXXXXX R.C.T.Q Madame Chef des Trolls
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.katedicey.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!
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Posted by Taria on September 23, 2009, 10:48 am
I remember having a chat about parenting with the school principal years
ago. Probably
most parents love their children to the ability they can. Problem is many
are pretty limited. A person needs to become what they will in spite of
things sometimes not because of them. I have a 55 yo sis that is really
just getting to the point that she doesn't blame the folks for her problems.
If you were to hear her description of our childhood and my description you
would think we come from different families. Just different attitudes
and perspectives. My dad and his many sibs grew up in terrible
circumstances. He just shakes his head and says his folks were uneducated
backwood
folk and did the best they could. Not all the sibs can do that. Out of 13
dad is still alive and healthy. Being angry just eats away at a body
in many ways. Not everyond has the ability to look into themselves.
Everyone has their own 'stuff' to work out in this life. Sure is easier
to let go though and move on. I agree with you there Gen.
Taria
show/hide quoted text
> What a sad statement, and one that certainly doesn't cover a great many
show/hide quoted text
> people. My parents may not have been the greatest , but they certainly
> did their best, and I have no complaints. My MIL was wonderful, as was my
> FIL-who I unfortunately only knew for 8 years before he died of cancer.
> There will never be any MIL jokes or complaints from here-I loved her! My
> son has written us on occasion to tell us how happy he is that we're his
> parents and how much he loves us. It seems to me, some use their parents
> as an excuse for their unhappiness, when they would do well to look into
> themselves.
> Gen
>
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>unfortunately I discovered last week that some of their treatment of me
>whilst growing up can't just be dismissed as a style of parenting, but
>a type of neglect verging on abuse, now I realise that, I can see how
>it has effected my sister too and I have to figure out how to forgive
>them and to continue forgiving them.
>Cheers
>Anne